Jason Isaacs on “the White Lotus” and His Best Roles: “Harry Potter,” “Peter Pan”

On Sunday, over 6 million people watched Jason Isaacs tear into pieces of so-called “suicide fruit,” pop them in a blender, and serve poisoned piña coladas to his fictional family on “The White Lotus.”

Though the HBO anthology series’ season three finale was full of twists and turns, none were quite so hard to swallow — literally — as the Ratliff family’s near-fatal cocktail hour, which remained a focus of watercooler gossip even though the season’s actual murders happened elsewhere.

It was the culmination of Isaacs’ year-and-a-half-long experience of living with and through Timothy Ratliff — first by putting on “a ton of weight” to embody the self-indulgent financier, then by portraying his Lorazepam-addled spiral during a seven-month shoot in Thailand, and finally by deciphering the character’s inner world for a long line of interviewers — all in the service of a rabid HBO audience eager to disseminate his juiciest quotes on social media and meme-ify his character’s Duke T-shirt-wearing anguish.

Though Isaacs, 61, has been a reliable scene-stealer for decades, his spotlight is brighter now than ever. Not that he’s hoping he’ll get recognized at the grocery store or photographed on the street.

“I will be as famous as I’ve been before, probably for as briefly as it was before,” Isaacs told Business Insider. “And then I’ll disappear back into the crowd, as has happened many times before. And that’s exactly how I like it.”

If you haven’t spent much time thinking about Isaacs prior to “The White Lotus,” that’s by design. Though he pops up everywhere from blockbusters like “Armageddon” to beloved franchises like “Harry Potter,” he’s made it his business to disappear into each of his characters without pretense or fanfare.

Since discovering his passion for acting while studying law, Isaacs spent the ’90s doing a bit of everything, from starring with Daniel Craig in the acclaimed play “Angels in America” to appearing alongside Laurence Fishburne in the cult classic sci-fi movie “Event Horizon.” But it was his performance in Roland Emmerich’s “The Patriot” as a sadistic British officer during the American Revolution that would become his breakthrough role — though Isaacs objects to the term.

“I’ve known a couple of people who are super famous. They have a part that changed their life forever,” Isaacs explained. “No part has changed my life forever. I just keep working.”

Though Isaacs said he was offered a host of top-billed villains after “The Patriot,” he turned most of them down, balking at the idea of accepting a role for more opportunities, more fame, or even more money. More than anything, he wants his audience to feel transported — an experience he’s had most often when the actor’s background or personal life is a mystery.

“When you ask me about my career,” Isaacs said, “what I really want is to just go, ‘If you ever see my name, watch it. Don’t ever read anything I say or watch anything I do on the internet.'”

For the latest interview in Business Insider’s Role Play series, Isaacs reflects on the twist-filled season three finale of “The White Lotus,” the “odd experience” of working on a Michael Bay set, and the real-life roots of Lucius Malfoy’s evil.

On what he thinks happened to the Ratliff family after leaving the White Lotus

Business Insider: In your last scene on the boat leaving the White Lotus, it doesn’t seem like Lachlan has any idea that he was nearly poisoned by his dad. Do you imagine that Tim would ever come clean about that?

I think Tim is going to do an awful lot of taking his own inventory and do an awful lot of soul-searching, and I think he will come clean about all of it.

I think Tim’s a new man. Most people don’t change. Mike [White] is far too good a writer to give everyone huge changes. They don’t change that much. Now, their circumstances are going to change a lot, and who knows what the Ratliffs will become when they have to face their new lives? But Tim has changed enormously, almost completely.

I can’t help but think about that epiphany the family’s going to have when they realize what was going on with the piña coladas. I mean, what a heart-wrenching moment it would be if Tim were to come clean about his intentions.

I don’t know, I think when their phones start pinging, there are other things they’ll be far more concerned about in the short term. Like, where are we going to live? How am I going to pay my cellphone bill? How are we going to put food in the fridge? All of their life plans have just been blown up. Piper wouldn’t be going back to the monastery, whether she wanted to or not, because they won’t be able to afford a plane ticket.

On saying yes to ‘Peter Pan’ and almost saying no to ‘Harry Potter’

You played Captain Hook in “Peter Pan” and Lucius Malfoy in the “Harry Potter” series. Did you ever worry you’d get typecast as a villain with great hair?

No. I did shoot the two of them at the same time and I was going to turn Lucius down because I knew I was doing Captain Hook. I thought, “Ugh, two children’s villains.” I was persuaded not to by most of my relatives — my godchildren, nephews, and nieces — because they wanted to visit the set, I think. Not because they cared about my career.

No, you don’t get typecast. There’s no such thing. You can be type-offered, but you have to take the jobs.

After “The Patriot,” for instance, which is another villain with a wig, I was offered a lot of bad guys opposite every single massively biceped, steroided-up, macho He-Man in Hollywood. And I turned ’em all down. I went and did a play and played a drag queen [in “Sweet November”] and “Black Hawk Down” and stuff.

So, when you are casting a film, which I’ve now done a few times, your first thought when someone goes, “It’s a crazy old man,” you go, oh, Bruce Dern. And then hopefully some good casting director goes, “The only thing is, he has done that 50 times. Do you want to be more imaginative than that?”

So I was the go-to for a minute — occasionally for more minutes when other films came out — for lip-curling, mustache-twirling villains, but I didn’t take the jobs.

Well, at least the wigs were amazing.

The wigs were amazing. I love a wig. The thing is, men don’t get to disguise themselves very much. Women can totally change their looks. And I love disguise.

I mean, I’m one of those actors that likes to try and be different every time, speak differently, walk differently, look differently. I put a ton of weight on to play Tim. I thought he was a fat cat and he’s just a guy who overindulges with red wine and desserts and caviar and the rest of it. So I like a wig because that’s part of the great disguise.

On the ‘joy’ of playing Lucius Malfoy and welcoming a new generation to Hogwarts

As somebody who likes to change their appearance and their style and their accent so much, was it difficult locking into such a long franchise like “Harry Potter” and having to return to that over and over?

Well, first of all, let me just display my allergy to the word franchise, which I hate. You are not the only person who uses it. I had a coffee in Starbucks this morning — that’s a franchise. Burger King is a franchise. “Harry Potter” is a story. Beautiful stories.

But it wasn’t difficult locking into it. It was a joy because every couple of years, I’d go to “Harry Potter” land for a month or two months. I wasn’t on it very much. I was doing many television series and films in between. Lucius, after “Chamber of Secrets,” made occasional appearances. But really, it was barely in my life. It was like going back to a holiday resort, seeing your old friends. It was a joy.

They’re working on casting a new version of “Harry Potter” as an HBO series.

I know! My daughter’s friend is in the casting office, and my goddaughter is in the writing room.

Have you suggested any actors that should take over your role?

One of the best casting directors in the world is doing it and they don’t need my suggestions. Actually, they’re getting phenomenal actors. It’s going to be brilliant.

It’s going to be weird for those of us who were in the films to be history and chip wrapping, but such is life. We’ve had a good run.

On Michael Bay vs. Ridley Scott and Shakespeare’s best advice

From what I know about your filmography and from what you’ve been saying, “Armageddon” feels a bit like an outlier. Do you see it that way?

Not really. I’d done “Event Horizon,” which was part of an ensemble.

I already had a bit of a career going in England. I was doing a comedy in Northern Ireland, Belfast, when I was offered “Armageddon” and they wanted me to drop out because filming started the next morning. I was offered one of the astronauts in “Armageddon.” And I went, “I can’t drop out!”

I remember this guy on the phone going, “Jason, you have to understand, this is a Bruce Willis project.” And I went, “Mate, this is a David Thewlis project! But it doesn’t make any difference. I’m still a professional actor. I signed a contract.” [He said,] “You let us handle that.” And I went, “No! You’re not handling anything. I’m getting up in six hours and I’m on set.”

They came back to me and said, “OK, if you can’t play one of the astronauts, do you want to play this part? It’s only eight days.” I remember the agent going, “But they’ll pay for you to stay in the hotel for six months. Six months, and we can get you some other meetings and work will go well.”

So, it was an odd film for me. I don’t know if it’s an anomaly. I wouldn’t have taken a part that small at the time, I think, if it hadn’t worked out this way.

On the very first day I did, frankly, the only scene I had lots of lines in. And Michael Bay took a shining to me and said, “Oh, that was great. Let’s have you back. We’ll give you a clipboard, we’ll stick you next to Billy Bob. You come in, you’ll be in all the scenes, and we’ll throw you a line here and there.”

At the time, because I’m nicely brought up, I went, “Oh, thanks so much,” thinking, “Are you fucking kidding me?” And then I was there, essentially as an extra, for six months. So it wasn’t my favorite experience, although I did get to go to NASA and meet the people who’d been up in the International Space Station, all the rest of it. But I didn’t like standing on the set for six months with a clipboard, hoping to be thrown a line like a fish on a fish farm.

That’s funny that it was framed almost like a reward because the director liked you, but it didn’t feel like a reward.

It’s not his fault. It was nice. Look, I’m around producing occasionally, very rarely directing. You want the best people you can have on set to do anything at all. It’s not insulting, but it’s just — I didn’t have any choice. I was paid for the whole film. I couldn’t say, “Well, actually, no, Michael, I’m just going to come in for the eight days you booked me for.”

So, I was there all the time — with, by the way, many other fabulous actors, who were great Broadway actors and people who were all the techs at NASA, who were also waiting to be thrown a line here and there. It was an odd experience. The entire film, frankly.

How does being directed by Michael Bay compare to being directed by someone like Ridley Scott a few years later?

[Laughs.] I don’t know how much you know about Michael Bay. I’m not telling stories out of school. He’s done lots of very successful films. It’s a very alpha, macho style he has with these giant movies. He shouts a lot, and there’s a lot of cameras swirling around, and there’s a lot of screaming going on. And I think he wants to build tension on the set so that he gets tension on the camera.

Ridley is just this visual genius. Very quiet. He’s whispering his orders to someone else and they’re telling you, communicating. On “Black Hawk Down,” we really had no contact with Ridley in many ways, because there were so many cameras. There were such gigantic scenes, he’d be in tent somewhere, and someone next to you with a walkie-talkie would tell you, “Walk down that street, the building’s going to fall on you. A tank’s going to fly over your head. Nine people are going to die and try and get your lines inside the helicopter.” And you’d go, “Sorry, just explain that to me again?” And they go, “Don’t worry, it’ll all work out. Action!” So it was less about character and story than it was about these enormous set pieces.

I know you said you turned down a lot of villain roles, but are you drawn to characters with a strong dark side?

Oh no, just drawn to well-written stories. I don’t really know what a villain is. If there’s a part that’s written to make the audience go, “Boo, hiss,” they’re very rarely human. Shakespeare said the job of storytelling is to hold the mirror up to nature. If you believe a character, you are going to react to them much more strongly. If they happen to be the antagonist in the story, fine, but they’re the hero of their own story.

I take parts when I go, “That’s a human being.” Lucius is an old-fashioned racist and he’s trying to make Hogwarts great again. He’s a guy that believes when old, white, rich people like him ruled the world — wizards with “pure” wizarding blood — it was better. The great American industrialists at the turn of the 20th century were all eugenicists. They didn’t think they were villains.

I take parts that are well-written. They make me look good as an actor because I look three-dimensional.

Have you ever played a character who was particularly difficult to shake, who felt like they were holding onto you?

No. I have a wife, and two kids, and a dog, and a mother-in-law, and old friends.

I feel them completely when I play them. And yes, I suppose if you’re crying all day, you’re not pretend-crying all day. So you feel sad somehow. Doing the film “Mass” was a study in grief and the great spiritual enlightenment that came with forgiveness. But if you’re in grief, or if you’re in anger all day, your cells carry it slightly.

But my brain could overcome that when I’m looking at people that I love. I know they’re not dead or I know that I’m not angry at them. And you just have to give yourself a little bit of decompression time — but not days or weeks. Minutes or hours.

That’s an important distinction. Some actors might say they live in it for longer than they intend to.

Well, then they’re idiots.

This interview has been edited and condensed for length and clarity.

“The White Lotus” season three is streaming in full on Max.

More from this series